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TOPIC: TCI-based Skimmer for EE products

TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 24 Jun 2022 00:17 #1

  • VK6NX
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@anyone who might be interested

3rd parth project - to build new cross-platform CW Skimmer for EE products - has commenced.

Will be completely unrelated to other skimmers, baased on TCI and new IQ file format, offered by 0.13.x+ versions of ESDR3 (with 32bit float and Sample rates: 48/96/192/384 kHz).

Will keep you informed about progress, please do not expect it will be ready in a few days.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 24 Jun 2022 09:41 #2

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That sounds amazing! Good luck with your project :D
Last Edit: 24 Jun 2022 09:42 by LA9AKA. Reason: Typo
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 24 Jun 2022 13:09 #3

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Pavel
This may be of interest. Al Peters (AC8GY) and Jack Purdum (W8TEE) developed yet another CW decoder for their T41-EP SDR transceiver that they claim is great. They gave a talk on it at the QRP ARCI FDIM earlier this year. There is a chapter on it in their book "Software Defined Radio Transceiver" and the source is at .
73
Bob KD8CGH
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 24 Jun 2022 13:10 #4

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73
Bob KD8CGH
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 24 Jun 2022 13:57 #5

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Let me expand.

I am not interested in, neither talking about developing "yet another" skimmer, which covers whole bunch of "yet another perfect SDRs", and whole range ofother boxes.

I am talking about targeted product of dedicated functionality (aka fully based on TCI integration only, and means removing obsolete protocols and functions). Based on EE-specific IQ format. Lightweight, low CPU/memory consumption. Maximum integrated with ESDSR3 design. And - this is crucial - developing with outstanding support from EE.

If there will be an interest, I may share later the fucntionality (and other) details for better understaning and line up the estimations.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 25 Jun 2022 11:59 #6

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I understand your specific goal. Let me be more clear.
As a part of their T41EP project Al and Jack have recently developed and open source published a CW decoder algorithm with a code implementation that they think is particularly efficient. They gave a talk on the algorithm at the QRP ARCI FDIM earlier this year. An explanation of the algorithm and the source code were supplied in the references. The info on the algorithm was offered in the spirit of being helpful to a new project that explicitly mentioned including a skimmer.

I look forward to seeing your application.
73
Bob KD8CGH
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 25 Jun 2022 13:24 #7

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Got it, Bob, thank you.

If you suggest me to look at the algorythm and check if it will be possible to re-use - I will certainly do.

Just couple things.
1. Not all codes are transferrable from one language to another. Hence, it very depends in which language it was written. FYI, I am targeting to use C++ for backend and QML for the frontend.
2. As part of the project I am also going to use proprietary code written earlier by EE. And this code I cannot disclose. Mixing open-source with proprietary is not the best idea, and it will make a problem in future (because while using open source code there is an obligation to disclose the parts where it was used).

Anyway. I quickly searched open-source places by keywords and did not find anything related to open-source with Al and Jack's names on it. Perhaps, I am looking in wrong place. The link you have published earlier requires to sign up to the group.
Last Edit: 25 Jun 2022 13:25 by VK6NX.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 28 Jun 2022 15:19 #8

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@ everyone interested.

Few things regarding Skimmer.

1. Initial functional technical description has been completed. We have clear roadmap now.
2. Development team sorted out. Very happy to say, that we have max level of cooperation with EE. This will lead to updated targets (in 3)
3. From now we have stopped targeting only single 3rd party version. Instead (at this stage) we plan to have two skimmer versions:
3a) Stable release, which will be either ESDR3-embedded or External native EE skimmer. Release tactics and roadmaps are TBD. An expectation, that most of you, guys, will use this skimmer version for common operations. Form of distribution and timelines for releases are TBA by EE (when time will come).
3b) 3rd party R&D release in "living" mode. May call is "permanent beta preview". This one will be used to deploy and test extended functions, alternative detection algorithms, non-common features and settings. It will be released periodically (as soon as new features/bugs arrive) with the main target to test functionality and decide, which features will be offered for native client to adopt.
4. Both verions will stay close-source, due to intensive use of EE' native libraries (such as IQ import, filtering, etc.)
5. Native skimmer release will be lined up with EE OS support; rd party one will be produced from start with Apple Silicon M1 support as well.
6. At this stage we do not have English version of the functional description, I hope I will have a time to translate it and publish. Up until then your potential questions are welcome in this thread. I will try to answer as much as I can, within "do not touch EE copyright boundaries".
7. We do have working pre-alpha now. Yep, we see dots and dits coming and ready to be procesed. This is to answer yur question "when". Soon.
8. No, it will not be "yet another skimmer".
9. At this stage only CW will be covered, other modes we will look accordingly after first release.
10. How it will look. Native - not decided yet. 3rd patry potentially may look like this (Note. that this is pre-alpha, thigs may change. Note 2 - yes it will max reuse of ESDR3 waterfall and bandscope):
skim-alpha.jpg


Hope this helps.

На русском.
1. Делаем скиммер. Вместе с ЕЕ. Бомбу не обещаю, но постараемся поднять максимально выше плинтуса. Фильтрация, оптимизация, алгоритмы - все новое, строго заточено под ESDR3 (и утритесь там со своим Ананом - я не из ЕЕ, могу сказать без дипломатии, что думаю :)). Никаких лишних "водопадов" - все полностью совместимое и в синхроне с ESDR3. В приоритете функционала - контестмены, экспедиции. Интеграция с логами только по TCI. Я не знаю "что будут делать споттеры с их телнет-агрегаторами" (может потом выпустит ЕЕ версию для колибри). Пока планируем делать две версии - будет "родной" скиммер от ЕЕ, и будет отдельно "постоянная бета" для влажных фантазий. Обе версии на одной базе. "За две недели" не обещаю, работа ведется, но надо понимать, что у ЕЕ есть ESDR3 и остальные продукты, которые в абсолютном приоритете. Как получится, так получится, мне самому он очень нужен, так что - "скоро". У меня все, вопросы тут в треде. Выше - как может вылядеть интерфейс, но это пока вообще пре-альфа, может сто раз поменяться.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 28 Jun 2022 20:50 #9

VK6NX wrote:
As part of the project I am also going to use proprietary code written earlier by EE. And this code I cannot disclose. Mixing open-source with proprietary is not the best idea, and it will make a problem in future (because while using open source code there is an obligation to disclose the parts where it was used).

How interesting!

That's why EE can't fix elementary bugs in ESDR2 and ESDR3 programs. Turns out they've been secretly "designing" the CW skimmer for years. And after many years of work, they realized that they could not do it, and decided to "give" the code VK6NX.

Request to Pavel VK6NX:

1. Check with EE who is the author of the code (first name, last name, call sign), you need to know the name of the brilliant author of the CW-skimmer code. The request is rhetorical, because I know for sure that EE is not developing the CW skimmer code.

2. Make sure that the skimmer code is actually written by EE, and not stolen, because EE had full access to the developments of the famous author.

Как интересно!

Вот почему EE не может исправить элементарные ошибки в программах ESDR2 и ESDR3. Оказывается, они много лет тайно "разрабатывали" CW-скиммер. И после многих лет работы поняли, что им это не под силу, и решили "дать" код VK6NX.

Просьба к Павлу VK6NX:

1.Уточните у ЕЕ, кто автор кода (имя, фамилия, позывной), нужно знать имя гениального автора кода CW-скиммера. Просьба риторическая, потому что я точно знаю, что EE не занимается разработкой кода CW-скиммера.

2. Убедитесь, что код скиммера действительно написан ЕЕ, а не украден, т.к. у ЕЕ был полный доступ к разработкам известного автора.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 28 Jun 2022 21:48 #10

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UR5LAM wrote:
...

1. Yep, already done. I know first names, surnames and callsigns (where applicable) of all three developers.
2. Code is Greenfield.

Александр, ответы выше. Понимаю, аглицкий вам не совсем родной, но для скандальчика, придется наморщить ум, гумпомощи не будет.

Инда в программировании вы явно ... девственник ... то предмета обсуждения, вот ей-ей, не наблюдаю. В психиатрии у меня степени нет, ищите специалиста. И поаккуратнее на поворотах с оценкой моей профпригодности, может выйти неловко, а я - вот беда - ни памперсами, ни пипифаксом не барыжу, и опять ничем вам помочь не смогу. Будете беспричинно буйствовать далее - уж не взыщите. "Успехов! Удачи! Всего!"(с)
Last Edit: 28 Jun 2022 21:52 by VK6NX.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 09 Jul 2022 05:59 #11

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"This is the Way" :yes:
Skimmer_workflow_2.jpg


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.
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Just to keep you interest in :D
Will it work like that? :crazy: ... (we do not know yet :hahaha: )
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 03 Sep 2022 12:41 #12

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Any progress?
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 04 Sep 2022 03:06 #13

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We have modules working, however still work in progress.

Currently working on enhancing parameters. Let me expand, what I mean on one example:
CWskimmer has average detecting rate after first and second decoding attempt about 60-65%. SDC is about 50-55%. The rate goes lower when signal is weak (1db above noise ground) or QRM/QRN/QSB. Waht we are targeting is maximum possible rate, certainly above 65%. Currently we have measured about 75-80, but there is still space for improvement.

There are some more targets (except detecting rate) as well.
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TCI-based Skimmer for EE products 07 Nov 2022 13:28 #14

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Where we are at?

The following modules are working (* = Status):
- Audio Stream module *completed
- Development UI module *completed
- Detector module (validates if the signal is ligitimate CW) *completed
- Decoder module (dynamic, one per valid signal) *final polishing
- Lingvo analysis module *not started
- Communication protocols module embedding *work in progress
- Final Horizontal UI *completed
- Final Vertical UI *work in progress

Communication protocl between QSO Logger and Skimmer is WS/JSON ( ws://IP:42042)
Communication protocl between Skimmer and ESDR3 is TCI

Beta release plan: ASAP. We are moving, not that fast as we would like, though.

Future plans after release: SS2-baased Skimmer Cluster, something like that:
Skimmercluster.jpg
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