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TOPIC: operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0

operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 04 Dec 2021 12:36 #16

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R3IIN wrote:
A bunch of "twirlers" and "turntables", i.e. manual control, is something that most users just don't need, everyone needs reasonable simplicity, that's why a special algorithm has been created.
Wha-a-a-a-a-a-at?

Roman! WTF, mate :pardon: ?

Having simplicity is (certainly) great thing for "basic" ESDR3 version, however there is a big "but" to it: it means all levels of all settings must be factory calibrated. I am sorry, simple question to that - how the hell we are going to get it to the devices, which are already in user hands, assuming that some of calibrations are hardware-dependent?
Hence - hide it, make it editable by changing JSON parameter in config - whatever - but make the calibration still possible. At the end of a day we are not talking about "making pizza" here and we are not talking about walkie-talkie. We are talking about very advanced device, predominantly used by people who can understand the things.

I predict that I will be fan of "basic" version, because I mainly work on field and I need less power consumed - "basic" should do that compared to "pro". But calibration simply the must. At least on basic level.

"Pro" vs "basic" ESDR3 simply should have more granular and extended calibration settings.

All above is IMHO, of course.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 04 Dec 2021 13:37 #17

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That 's why I wrote in the ESDR2 version and suggest in ESDR3 !!! It is NECESSARY to insert an indicator into the sound modules "Proc" for each processing device!
bandicam2021-12-0416-24-40-047.jpg
Last Edit: 04 Dec 2021 13:39 by R3IIN.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 04 Dec 2021 14:28 #18

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But friends, they won't do it quickly without your support!!!
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 04 Dec 2021 17:37 #19

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I thought it would look better by design like this ! Each indicator works on its own module, in the "bypass" it turns off and does not work! The only indicator that works in the "bypass" mode is the indicator that participates last in the circuit of the "Proc" module at its output - this makes it possible to assess the level of voice in the speaker!!! If I'm wrong, guys correct me!!
bandicam2021-12-0222-59-07-914.jpg
Last Edit: 04 Dec 2021 17:39 by R3IIN.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 04 Dec 2021 21:32 #20

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I am not sure about exact design ... for mic it can be as proposed above. Here I would better rely on EE development team to decide where to locate it.

However. I had a look at Github and it appears that we do not have yet all calibration issues listed there with except of Issue#15.

I believe we need to consolidate all existing calibration issues and submit (all structured) to Github, so Dev team will understand better what is required and will be able properly estimate. As I have mentioned in addition to pink noise I recall seeing panorama calibration, SWR, power, CW break-in - and I am sure there will be more. I remember I've been sending to Roman videos about different panorama dBi reading under SS2 and DX, and also reporting with video the power output mismatch - so, I can easily retrieve that and submit once I am back from the sea (should be coming Tue).

Can anyone else check the forum, collect and submit SWR and CW calibration, please?
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 06 Dec 2021 13:25 #21

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I wrote my suggestions to Roman to the Expert Electronics company. I am waiting for an answer, Friends, thank you so much for your support and information exchange! It is very important to have not only an expensive transceiver on the table, but also to make the program work well and make us happy with the purchase and give creativity and joy!
Last Edit: 06 Dec 2021 13:31 by R3IIN.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 06 Dec 2021 19:23 #22

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Yes I support proper metering where 0dB is unity gain for all proc modules.

So for example if you inject into mic 1 or 2 a 1khz sine wave @ 0dB it should be 0dB at the last stage of the proc menu before it goes into the P.A. if all processes are bypassed in the proc menu.

Accurate metering will help users make sure they are driving but not over driving each stage/processes in the proc menu.
Transceiver: MB1 Prime 2021
HF Amplifier: Ameritron AL-1200
HF Antennas:10-80 Vertical, 10-80 Fan Dipole
VHF Antenna: Commet GP-9
Last Edit: 06 Dec 2021 19:28 by John-KC2QMA.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 06 Dec 2021 20:19 #23

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I hope some day we have the ability to run VST audio plug-in’s in ESDR3 I think it is the way of the future for SDR radio and I think Expert Electronics can be a true pioneer in this area.

The way I see the future for the “Processing Menu” in eesdr3 is by default the software will come with the standard audio tools enabled that come esdr3 now. But there will be an option to bypass/turn off the standard audio tools and open one or more VST audio plugins.

One of the advantages for expert electronics they wont have to spend time and money developing these audio tools or providing tech supporting them.
The advantage for the end user is for the operator who just wants simple audio tools the built-in tools are just fine. But for many users and growing who are experimenting with ESSB and advanced audio processing VST plug-in’s are the way to go.

That being said if EE can make the built-in audio tools a bit more accurate and easy to use with good metering I would be totally happy with that as well.
Transceiver: MB1 Prime 2021
HF Amplifier: Ameritron AL-1200
HF Antennas:10-80 Vertical, 10-80 Fan Dipole
VHF Antenna: Commet GP-9
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 06 Dec 2021 20:31 #24

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:yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: and I completely agree ! that VST plugins would be good to use and then programs and blocks for audio processing are not needed ! It would be very cool, this topic has been discussed for a long time, but first I wanted them to put all the levels in order and do sound level control from the modules in the "Proc" block!!! I am doing ESSB myself and purchased an MB-1 transceiver
Last Edit: 06 Dec 2021 20:42 by R3IIN.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 06 Dec 2021 20:38 #25

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Yes one thing at a time. First get the built-in "Proc Block's" the best they can be then maybe add VST capability later.
Transceiver: MB1 Prime 2021
HF Amplifier: Ameritron AL-1200
HF Antennas:10-80 Vertical, 10-80 Fan Dipole
VHF Antenna: Commet GP-9
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 06 Dec 2021 23:56 #26

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Here is my sloppy image of what the meters could look like.
The most important thing for me is input and output meters for each of the blocks and Red, Yellow, Green for Gate and Clipper status.

proc_2021-12-07.png
Transceiver: MB1 Prime 2021
HF Amplifier: Ameritron AL-1200
HF Antennas:10-80 Vertical, 10-80 Fan Dipole
VHF Antenna: Commet GP-9
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 07 Dec 2021 00:59 #27

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John-KC2QMA wrote:
Here is my sloppy image of what the meters could look like.
The most important thing for me is input and output meters for each of the blocks and Red, Yellow, Green for Gate and Clipper status.

proc_2021-12-07.png

I think your crowding things

If you have an input and output on the first stage
wouldn't you know what the input is for the next (following stage) so some of these could be eliminated
so if the stages had outputs is there really a need for an input (with exception of the first) stage

while I agrees there certainly could be much more info (metering/indications) of things keep in mind that it would get very crowded and all those would introduce a bit more load of CPU and graphics (one thing I can certainly say has been lower) then other SDR since I have been using EESDR

John think back when we had the earlier FLEX 1500/3000/5000 and power SDR (there were drop downs with metering between the stages) you followed things in a progressive order from one stage to the next that metering If I recall worked rather well and it wasn't over complicated or used up display area, like this www.w1aex.com/psdrgain/psdrgain.html
as a refresher it looked and functioned as outlined here (now I'm not saying rip this off and make it look like this) but if metering were in one location and was perhaps possibly have a switching option for each stage to show what that stage was doing, personally I think it would look better -be easier to follow

meteringsuggestion.png

or

Screenshot2021-12-06200151.gif
73 Rick
Last Edit: 07 Dec 2021 01:10 by N8SDR.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 07 Dec 2021 06:03 #28

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: :so_happy: :so_happy: :so_happy: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: Rick! I liked John's option more, no need to run and switch the meter to different points, everything is immediately visible, what and where is overloaded!!! And the design is better drawn than mine !!! Bravo John!!! It remains for the Expert Electronics team to implement it quickly, and not promise to do it!!! :wall: :wall: :wall:
:write: :write:
P/S Although the indicator after the DC module and the rota are not needed, these modules do not make changes to the signal strength!!! I've already measured it!!!
Last Edit: 07 Dec 2021 06:08 by R3IIN.
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 07 Dec 2021 07:47 #29

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Friends! Today I received an answer from Roman !Roman liked this offer, here is his answer....
Good afternoon, Igor.
Thank you, this is the right approach.
I ask you to post your proposal here by creating a discussion in the proposals section.github.com/ExpertSDR3/ExpertSDR3-SUGGESTIONS/discussions
And those people who agree with you, just let them vote for your proposal.
In any case, we will deal with such functionality after the release of ESDR3 1.0, that is, after the introduction of the main functions.
But your suggestion, as for me, is really useful.
--
Sincerely yours
Head of the Commercial Department
Roman Volchkov
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operation "Pink noise" ESDR3 v 0.10.0 07 Dec 2021 12:06 #30

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R3IIN wrote:
Friends! Today I received an answer from Roman !Roman liked this offer, here is his answer....
Good afternoon, Igor.
Thank you, this is the right approach.
I ask you to post your proposal here by creating a discussion in the proposals section.github.com/ExpertSDR3/ExpertSDR3-SUGGESTIONS/discussions
And those people who agree with you, just let them vote for your proposal.
In any case, we will deal with such functionality after the release of ESDR3 1.0, that is, after the introduction of the main functions.
But your suggestion, as for me, is really useful.
--
Sincerely yours
Head of the Commercial Department
Roman Volchkov

Well, that is some good news

I will follow up on the discussion group on GitHub
73 Rick
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